Curse

Numa Pompilius · Jul 29, 2005, 01:55 PM // 13:55

I'm just wondering... If the economy is so broken that everything costs +100K, howcome it is impossible to sell max damage weapons which do not have all maxed upgrades for more than at most a couple of thousand?

I've spent the morning clearing my storage, trying to sell e.g. a gold vampiric maxdamage longbow 2/-1, +21 health, +5 armor, req 8 marksmanship. It took me half an hour and repeated visits to different districts in Ascalon, Yaks Bend, Amnoon, and Lions Arch to get an offer of 3000 for it.

Purple/gold max damage hammers with +4-5 armor, longer enchant, or +20ish health, or +1 hammer mastery didn't move until I had dropped the price to 300 gold. All had requirements under 9.

I had four purple/gold max armor shields, requirement tactics 7-9. I tried to sell them for 1000, but ended up selling one, which had +20 health while in stance, for 300 gold, the others I had to sell to a merchant. Noone wanted them. Same happened with non-max sword, axe, and hammer upgrades: noone wanted a single one, even for 100 gold.

I did however get a whopping 1500 gold for a gold max-damage Flamberge with +17% damage in a stance and +5 armor in a stance, req 7 swordsmanship.

IMO the problem isn't inflation, it's mudflation.

It's just that the people complaining about inflation want a gold max perfect everything storm bow, eternal shield, chaos axe, or fellblade (because they LOOK good). Nothing else. And they want it cheap.

Algren Cole · Jul 29, 2005, 02:01 PM // 14:01

gold does not mean good...that longbow is junk. The refire rate on a longbow makes the 2/-1 worthless...even spamming dual shot or coupling with barrage you are barely breaking even. +21HP isn't something a Ranger Needs.

The problem with shields is that nobody cares...+16 armor isn't worth the extra money when you get +15 or +14 drops all the time...and that +14 or +15 shields go for under 500gold.

There is no market for Non-Max weapons(unfortunately)

Loviatar · Jul 29, 2005, 02:12 PM // 14:12

[QUOTE=Algren Cole]gold does not mean good...that longbow is junk. QUOTE]

question please on vampiric

is a 4/-1 bowstring
ok
good
or very good
but but the best by a long shot

i got one a while ago

edit

stupid question but is it worth anything?

Algren Cole · Jul 29, 2005, 02:23 PM // 14:23

it all depends on the bow Loviatar. The problem with vampiric is that you are losing 1 every second...and nothing in the game attacks at a rate fast enough to make up for the -1 every second. So you need to couple the weapon with a skill that attacks multiple targets to really see it's benefit. You also need to use a bow with the fastest refire rate. Short Bow, halfmoon & flatbow are the best bows for vampiric upgrades(presumably the best in the game for this upgrade). The refire rate on halfmoon, short bow & flatbow is 2.0 seconds with an arrow flight time of .65 seconds. Couple this with a dual shot or barrage and you'll easily make up the -1.

Of the Vampiric Strings I've used on my ranger I've found that it's difficult to make up for the degen until you've hit 3/-1(which becomes significantly easier than 2/-1). With a 3/-1 coupled with something as simple as just Dual Shot you're gaining 6HP every 2 seconds or so and have only lost 2 HP. So even with a primitive vampiric build the advantages are obvious. 4/-1 is in my opinion the best vampiric upgrade for a ranger. You aren't spending 100K for a silly string like you would with 5/-1 and the difference between the HP gains of 5/-1 and 4/-1 are negligible.

From what i've witnessed Tigers Fury/Barrage is the best way to take advantage of vampiric bow strings. Could even mess around with the effeciency of spirits to speed up flight times.

bottom line: 4/-1 is a VERY good if not best vampiric bowstring.(IMHO)

Loviatar · Jul 29, 2005, 02:33 PM // 14:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

it

From what i've witnessed Tigers Fury/Barrage is the best way to take advantage of vampiric bow strings. Could even mess around with the effeciency of spirits to speed up flight times.

bottom line: 4/-1 is a VERY good if not best vampiric bowstring.(IMHO)

thank you

i have a ranger sightseeing in presear which i may use it on later with a decent bow.

also i will have another non vampiric bow to switch off to as fast as i can as well

Shadow_Avenger · Jul 29, 2005, 02:56 PM // 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

it all depends on the bow Loviatar. The problem with vampiric is that you are losing 1 every second...and nothing in the game attacks at a rate fast enough to make up for the -1 every second. So you need to couple the weapon with a skill that attacks multiple targets to really see it's benefit. You also need to use a bow with the fastest refire rate. Short Bow, halfmoon & flatbow are the best bows for vampiric upgrades(presumably the best in the game for this upgrade). The refire rate on halfmoon, short bow & flatbow is 2.0 seconds with an arrow flight time of .65 seconds. Couple this with a dual shot or barrage and you'll easily make up the -1.

Of the Vampiric Strings I've used on my ranger I've found that it's difficult to make up for the degen until you've hit 3/-1(which becomes significantly easier than 2/-1). With a 3/-1 coupled with something as simple as just Dual Shot you're gaining 6HP every 2 seconds or so and have only lost 2 HP. So even with a primitive vampiric build the advantages are obvious. 4/-1 is in my opinion the best vampiric upgrade for a ranger. You aren't spending 100K for a silly string like you would with 5/-1 and the difference between the HP gains of 5/-1 and 4/-1 are negligible.

From what i've witnessed Tigers Fury/Barrage is the best way to take advantage of vampiric bow strings. Could even mess around with the effeciency of spirits to speed up flight times.

bottom line: 4/-1 is a VERY good if not best vampiric bowstring.(IMHO)

I want to know where you get these wonderful figures from. Do you sit there with a stop watch?

I have read a fair bit of tech stuff about the game on this site, but I have yet to see A.net back it up.
The stuff about armours and how its worked out, etc etc.
Either you are disecting the actually code to get these tit bits, you know an insider who codes the game or you make it all up on the spot.
Please let me know were you guys get all this wonderful info.

P.S. this is not intended as an attack on anyone, but I would really like to know how you get said info.

Mithie · Jul 29, 2005, 03:10 PM // 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

I did however get a whopping 1500 gold for a gold max-damage Flamberge with +17% damage in a stance and +5 armor in a stance, req 7 swordsmanship.

This is why you need to post these items on auction places on forums like this one. I would easily pay 5k for that flamberge, maybe more.

Quote:

IMO the problem isn't inflation, it's mudflation.

It's just that the people complaining about inflation want a gold max perfect everything storm bow, eternal shield, chaos axe, or fellblade (because they LOOK good). Nothing else. And they want it cheap.

Sucks, don't it?

Algren Cole · Jul 29, 2005, 03:12 PM // 15:12

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/content...ies-id1092.php

the information contained in that guide is pretty accurate for bows...though I personally think the numbers for the composite bow are off...though I could have just not timed it correctly. I had closer to 2.6 for the refire rate.

Shagsbeard · Jul 29, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Others have pointed this out differently, but let me summarize:

Guild wars is not a game about collecting gear.

No one needs your stuff, so no one wants to buy it. Sure, you're going to find someone who thinks that items are important and will trade you for them, but the game is not about finding the best items.

MSecorsky · Jul 29, 2005, 03:21 PM // 15:21

I wonder if people like me that pop into Ascalon and give those things away are having an effect?

LathalDraugr · Jul 29, 2005, 03:39 PM // 15:39

The guild wars "economy" is non-existant really. There's no reason to buy anything other than for it's appearance and if you're buying a stormbow you probably want it to be as good as the free items so you're going to need it to be perfect. But perfect rare bows etc. are rare so people know they can charge for them. take this sale for example: Link

My collectors ascalon bow with 15%>50 and armour +5 (req 8 or 9 IIRC) is better than that and I haven't even decided on a bowstring to put in it yet. My bow cost me 2k for the 5 frozen shells because I was too lazy to go and get them myself, this bow is going for 60k so far and a perfect 15>50 would be well over 100k by now but it would still not be better than the ugly but functional collectors ascalon longbow. People pay for the looks not for the stats. The stats are easy to get but the look and the stats are not, so it costs.

Numa Pompilius · Jul 29, 2005, 03:42 PM // 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shagsbeard

Guild wars is not a game about collecting gear.

No one needs your stuff, so no one wants to buy it. Sure, you're going to find someone who thinks that items are important and will trade you for them, but the game is not about finding the best items.

You don't understand - I'm not complaining that noone wanted my gear, or that I didn't get enough money. I've got plenty.
I'm complaining about the people complaining that "everything" in Guildwars is too expensive. That the economy is broken and suffering from hyperinflation.

But that isn't the case at all. Only perfect weapons and only of a very few types are really expensive.

Another way of putting it is this: Insomuch as the GW economy at all has a problem, it isn't too much cash (inflation), it's too many high-level items (mudflation).

Darkest Dawn · Jul 29, 2005, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

You don't understand - I'm not complaining that noone wanted my gear, or that I didn't get enough money. I've got plenty.
I'm complaining about the people complaining that "everything" in Guildwars is too expensive. That the economy is broken and suffering from hyperinflation.

But that isn't the case at all. Only perfect weapons and only of a very few types are really expensive.

Another way of putting it is this: Insomuch as the GW economy at all has a problem, it isn't too much cash (inflation), it's too many high-level items (mudflation).

Great point! I have no problems whatsoever with the economy.

Granted, I don't hawk my wares, I just sell off(to merchant) or give away what I don't need. Still, I find no real issues other than the Superior vigor being 87 plat(give or take) and the Sup vigor not even on the rune seller's list whenever I check, lol

DioneR · Aug 24, 2005, 01:45 PM // 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

thank you

i have a ranger sightseeing in presear which i may use it on later with a decent bow.

also i will have another non vampiric bow to switch off to as fast as i can as well

5:1 bow string on a long bow+mending= awsome

Dax · Aug 24, 2005, 02:25 PM // 14:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

I'm just wondering... If the economy is so broken that everything costs +100K, howcome it is impossible to sell max damage weapons which do not have all maxed upgrades for more than at most a couple of thousand?

That's the part thats broken, no one is interested in midlevel items. Why buy them? Everyone only cares about certain items.

If in fact there were some level restrictions on things there'd be a more robust economy.

Hey everyone says they don't wanna grind, collect items, or worry about levels and this is what they get. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

noblepaladin · Aug 24, 2005, 02:32 PM // 14:32

Yeah, I agree that what is happening is "mudflation". As for PvE, it is a type of broken economy. As a fan of many RPG and PvE games, I think this type of economy has completely ruined the game. Two of my friends just brought the game and are starting from the beginning, with the intention of doing every quest in the game and not rushing or charging ahead. I made a new character to play with them. One of them finds a black dye and sells it for 10k (this was during the older patch when black dye went up to as high as 30k). After selling the dye the moment he got to Ascalon, he was able to buy the best set of Ascalon armor and a desert collector sword (statistically the best in the game already) and 5 minor runes for his armor. We were invulnerable until Yak's bend. When the game was released, there was actually a reason to do the sidequests because you need time to gather materials (which were way to expensive to buy), gold, and weapons. This type of economy forces players through the game so fast that PvE is no longer as enjoyable as it should be.

Now on the otherside, the PvP side, people who played the game once don't want to play it again at least two more times. They want to unlock skills fast, so they farmed (which is what led to the severe depression of material prices, steel dropped about 10x from 2000g to 200g a piece compared to the early days) trying to get runes and components as well as money and equipment for their next characters. This is probably why running services began, because players wanted to get through the game faster. The PvP unlocking system simply conflicts with PvE playing in general.

So basically right now, because of this type of economy, everything is dirt cheap except the extremely good and cool looking items. Stuff is so cheap that everybody is almost given the best possible equipment (statistically) at the beginning of the game. Even for new players, the only thing really that is left to do is to get cooler looking stuff.

StarGatherer · Aug 24, 2005, 02:35 PM // 14:35

Dammit ,i am still waiting for a Stone of Jordan to drop!!!

Forboding Angel · Aug 24, 2005, 02:36 PM // 14:36

Point of interest

With -1 regen you are actually losing .30 en per second. Takes 3 secs to lose 1 en.

Algren Cole · Aug 24, 2005, 03:38 PM // 15:38

Angel: I should have been more specific the 1 I am refering to is 1 pip not 1 hit point.

Numa Pompilius · Aug 25, 2005, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by noblepaladin

Yeah, I agree that what is happening is "mudflation". As for PvE, it is a type of broken economy. As a fan of many RPG and PvE games, I think this type of economy has completely ruined the game.

It certainly takes all the fun out of the loot, that's for sure. It's not until you get to the Lions Arch area you have decent chance of getting a drop of ANYTHING you could not buy for 2-300.

The solution is an item sink. You listening, Anet?